- This topic has 9 replies, 2 voices, and was last updated 11 years, 10 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
This is a short one because Bucho wanted to hear my thoughts on UFC 167. So yeah, if you don’t watch UFC, this one ain’t for you. Sorry.
Direct Link: 20131118.mp3
GOOD TIMES! You even got your show out before Ariel. And he calls himself a professional.
- Women sense my power and they seek the life essence.
You did a great job summing it all up Rob, you were measured, you were rational and I think you were right. I watched the whole fight twice on the night and the first round again the next day, and given that we also have to consider that the judges don’t see the best angles as we do (they have a separate CCTV feed for when the fighters are obscured from their position I think) it is understandable two of them gave that very close first round for the champ.
Even though you and I, 16 out of 18 journalists and 37 ot of 40 fighters gave it to Johny.
I felt bad for GSP though, I mean, it’s probably dumb to feel sorry for a millionaire superhero, but he really does seem tortured. And the scarring is one thing, but the other thing is he’s getting hit by Carlos Condit and Johny Hendricks, and those guys throw more damaging strikes. It’s not that Georges doesn’t have the power, but his conservative style means fewer shots of the type that attack dogs like Carlos and Johny throw, plus in both fights he’s been hit by a bunch of elbows. One reason you don’t see the damage at the end of the first round after Johny’s elbows is it takes time to manifest visibly, which is also why fighters look worse at the presser than they do at the final bell.
But you’re right, all we can do now is hope GSP recovers and reconsiders fast. Dana is clearly amped to make the fight, Johny is clearly amped to get in there again, the only one we need to play ball is Georges.
- Women sense my power and they seek the life essence.
I didn’t really get it out beforehand – his show was still going at the time, but anyway…
Yeah, I don’t think that Georges won’t fight. I think that he’s just got some personal problems that he needs to work out, and I don’t even think retirement is really on his mind.
The MMA Hour had a lot of good points, though. Why not have a scoreboard so the fighters know exactly where they stand? Why not use a different scoring system than the 10-point system? Interesting ideas.
Oh, I haven’t heard Ariel’s show yet, I listen to the audio version once it’s posted and it’s still not up.
I always hated the scoreboard idea because you’ll get guys who are ahead coasting for the last round. Shit, we saw Johny more or less coast R5 just because he believed he was ahead, imagine how that goes if he’s certain.
For years I’ve been in favour of sticking with 10 point must but expanding it so that there are more 10-8s and 10-7s. Johny dominated the rounds he won, whereas Georges just squeaked by in his, and it’s dumb that the system doesn’t allow the scores to reflect that. It’s a boxing system, designed for 6-12 rounds where things average out more, and doesn’t work out great for MMA.
The other thing I wish could happen, speaking of averaging out, but which will never happen is to use 5 judges instead of three. Like in the Olympic gymnastics or diving where they have 7 judges to smooth over anomalies. The more judges the better. But the more expensive, which is why it’s a no-go.
- Women sense my power and they seek the life essence.
Regarding the coasting – the point being made is that boxing and mma are the only two sports where the competitors don’t know the score. I think it would actually make the fights more exciting, because in this case, Johny coasted in the 5th because his corner told him it was 3-1. Don’t you think he would fight differently if he knew that it was even? And if he actually was up 3-1, at that point, he’d earned that right. In every other sport, if it’s a blowout, whether it’s football or soccer or tennis or whatever – coasting is a right. I’m actually convinced that it’d be awesome – in blowouts, it should light a fire under the one that’s down, and in close fights like this one, coasting would be a non-issue.
You’re not wrong about the coasting being “earned”, but there would be much more of it and it’s a bad look for the sport. If it’s even, like in GSP/Johny, it’d be good, but if it’s uneven the guy who’s behind would probably get loose and desperate while the guy in the lead would backpedal away from any engagement at all. I know how games get when one team is playing out time and the other is playing desperate, and yeah, it’s earned, but 90% of the time it’s shithouse to watch.
The other reason live scoreboard is a bad idea, which is probably even worse than the coasting, is that more fights would be ruined due to fouls. A guy knows he’s up, gets hit in the nuts or eye-poked, suddenly more guys are deciding they can’t continue the fight. Because why take more damage and risk than you need to? There’s enough gaming the system as it is in this sport with the cockamamie downed fighter rule, I don’t think it’s wise to create more opportunities for it.
On the plus side, I was happy to hear Ariel supporting the same scoring idea I do – expanding the range of the 10 point must. Especially since he wasn’t talking half-points, but going with more 10-8s and 10-7s. I hate half-points.
- Women sense my power and they seek the life essence.
To me, that’s the problem with the scoring system in any way that you do it. Because it’s so subjective. Just as all 10-9s aren’t the same now, you have the same problem when you introduce more 10-8s and 10-7s.
I don’t agree with Ariel talking about damage being part of the scoring system. That being said, I still have to say that the elbows Hendricks landed in the first round was the most significant thing in that round.
Yeah, I don’t think making “damage” an explicit part of the scoring is necessary or even particularly helpful or fair. “Effective striking” seems to be out of fashion but I still think it’s the best term.
But I see the subjectivity and the scoring range as problems which are intrinsically linked but which can be worked on separately to some extent. Because sure, you can never eliminate subjectivity when pesky humans are involved and there will at times be disagreement between judges in terms of 10-7s vs 10-8s vs 10-9s, but the argument isn’t that a 10 point must with expanded range will mitigate subjectivity, it’s simply that even with subjectivity involved it will provide a more accurate score for the fight overall than the current system which treats an MMA bout as 3-5 separate mini-fights.
- Women sense my power and they seek the life essence.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.